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Re: NEON- Tube benders Assoc.

Reply from dirk:

>I see Jeff's point as a good point and I must admit that we,
>unfortunately, have these fligh by night installers overhere in >the
>Netherlands as well. 
Tells us a little more about how successful your local association is at
controlling your "fligh by night" installers. How much do you have to pay in
dues and other fees?

By the way, I am still very interested in hearing about your neon business
and getting some idea about the cost structure in running a neon business in
the Netherlands. It appears with all the regulations you are talking about,
the cost per foot must be rather high.

I am also curious to know if you are involved in the business end of running
a neon shop or do you focus your activities to the technical side of the
business.

>sign companies and the installers are receiving the black >money from the
>bar owners, meanwhile using and spilling the materials that >are owned
>from there boss or the company they work for.

>Of course this >mentality
>must be stopped. These guys are removing the profit away >from the
>company they work for and then again I will go for the social >aspect.
With all the regulations you apparently have in place in the Netherlands, how
do you propose stopping this activity?

>way the labour of dozens of collegues is in danger. We call >that an
>a-social behaviour and these guys, or at least their mentality, >must be
>re-socialised. 
Please expand on some of the methods you would use to re-socialize. If
successful, we could use the same methods to re-socialize the criminal
element in our country.

>There was onother reply on this subject telling the list that >you alson
>could spare on materials.
Expand a little more on this. Please feel free to point out the specific
statement. It is hard to know what reply your are referring to.

My goodness. Last week I saw on >Dutch
>television an old movie called The Towering Inferno and >everybody who
>have seen that movie knows what damage can be done when a >contractor or
>an electrical installer is trying to spare on materials. 
Interesting you should use this example. The construction industry is one of
the most heavily regulated, inspected and policed industries. Yet people find
ways to get around all these rules............. (by the way, there are
sufficient real life collapses of buildings, most recently in Korea if I
remember, and bridges to allow the Towering Inferno fiction to illustrate the
concept).

>So, John if you don't think that I am too forwarded let's try to >make
>the first move, as a association needs to have members.
>Let's ask all your members of this list hereby and they must >give you
>that in apersonal reply to John:
>"WHO IS AGAINST THE IDEA". Maybe a few will react but then >at least we
>know who is not against. AND THAT WILL BE THE START!
I think the question is not who is against the idea, rather the question is
who is ready to send in money to join an organization that has yet to define
its mission in communicable and measurable terms. So I personally think it is
premature yet to launch an organization without first defining its mission.

One of the greatest strengths of the open market concept is the built-in
impartial voting system. You come up with a good idea and effectively
communicate the benefits of the idea, people respond by sending you the funds
(typically in the form of dues).

>So John, ask your members to tell you in a personal mail whi >is against,
>and that will be the first seaparation.
When you say separation, do you mean starting a new mailing list, cutting off
the current subscribers to this list...... or what? 

I also would like to know what you mean by "against". As I commented a little
earlier, there is no specific proposal to respond to.

JP
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